University Governance: Strategic Insights from Brown’s 250-Year Legacy:

Changing Higher Education podcast 225 with host Dr. Drumm McNaughton and guest Lauren Zalaznick

Transcript: Changing Higher Ed Podcast 225

Drumm McNaughton: [00:00:00] Thank you, David. My guest today is Lauren Zelaznik. Lauren is an author, a publisher, board director, and strategic advisor. You may not know her, but she’s had an exceptional career transforming the cultural landscape. She’s received two Peabody Awards, numerous Emmy Awards, Time Magazine has named her one of the Time 100 World’s Most Influential People, and her interviews have been archived by the Television Academy Foundation.

Lauren recently released a book called “Letters from the Corporation of Brown University: Lives of Usefulness and Reputation”. And she joins me today to talk about the lessons that boards can learn from having read this book, and some of them would be able to easily inform our perspectives on the range of issues which the university and many other universities are still grappling with.

 Lauren, welcome to the show.

Lauren Zalaznick: Thank you so much. It’s a pleasure to be here.

Drumm McNaughton: I am glad to meet you [00:01:00] and looking forward to a great conversation. You recently released a new book, which essentially gives the history of Brown University through the lens of trustees. The book was entitled “Letters from the Corporation of Brown University: Lives of Usefulness and Reputation”.

Before we get into that, and there are just some incredible learnings in there, if you wouldn’t mind giving the listeners just a little bit of your background. When I read it the other day, I was blown away, you have just done so many incredible things in your life. Please tell us

Lauren Zalaznick: Thank you for that warm introduction, I’m looking forward to engaging, about all these incredible letters and learnings from the perspective of higher ed. My career, it’s interesting to have been the editor of this book because most of my career has been spent in media, first in film, then [00:02:00] television, then digital media. I’ve been known to transform a bunch of brands from VH1 in the ’90s and 2000s to the Bravo Network and others in the 2000s right up to a few years ago.

It’s hard for me to talk about my own bio, but I’ve enjoyed amazing things like an interview with the Smithsonian, researching and delivering a TED talk about television, and deep in my background, now that I’m an oldster, I am a Brown University graduate, and a trustee emerita.

Drumm McNaughton: That is incredible. I didn’t know these things about you. And doing this book, “Letters From the Corporation of Brown University”, because you’re a trustee emerita and a graduate, I’m sure it had deeper meaning than just someone who would be walking off the street without such a connection to Brown.

Lauren Zalaznick: That’s [00:03:00] true. It’s certainly meaningful to me because I lived on campus for four years. I went back to campus as an alum, and I lived on campus meetings-wise for the six years of my trusteeship. However, one of the most important things for me to say at the outset was actually in a review, in Graydon Carter’s Airmail publication, which basically said, “if you think this book isn’t for you because you didn’t go to Brown, you’d be wrong”. So again, I’m glad someone else said that, and the reason is that these are resignation letters of the Trustees and Fellows of the Corporation of Brown from its founding in 1764 to the most recent letter which is from a 2023 grad. And presenting [00:04:00] these reproductions and excerpts from quill and ink to emails and texts, the letters do reflect a deep connection to Brown, as well they should, but writ large, the whole volume really speaks to a reflection of the whole country’s social, cultural, and political transformation over time.

Drumm McNaughton: I definitely want to get into that, but as we were talking the other day, you had mentioned a couple of things which really blew me away. One, the premise of this book, it opens the doors on the institution’s board and the leadership role in upholding the values and the ethos of the institution, but two how the letters are delivered. That was amazing.

Lauren Zalaznick: It’s a great point to bring up because the real [00:05:00] reason this book exists, almost 10 years ago, it was at the end of my first year as a trustee, and at the last meeting of the year, which coincides with commencement weekend in May, one of the points on the agenda was the resignation of trustees and fellows whose terms were up.

It turns out that by a quirk of governance, it is required that the trustees and fellows write a physical letter of resignation to signify the end of their term. What is more a tradition of governance, not a written piece of governance, is that each letter is read out loud in front of the whole body of the corporation, that’s 54 people, including the president, the chancellor, and all of the officers, and they are read out loud, unedited, [00:06:00] in front of the whole group, no matter what they say.

So if I hadn’t had that chance hearing of some of these and then being ultimately inspired and even blown away by many, without the governance the book wouldn’t exist.

Drumm McNaughton: And that is such an unusual thing. I’ve never heard of another institution who does that. There’s one thing I want to clear up is when you say members of the corporation, the members of the corporation are the same as your board members, correct?

Lauren Zalaznick: Yes, we say members of the corporation because it’s not a board. It’s very technical, but it’s a bicameral body of trustees and fellows who have clearly defined roles, but each have the same vote, so to speak. But yes, when I say members of the corporation, it is a body [00:07:00] of 54 people comprised of trustees and fellows.

Drumm McNaughton: Thank you. Give me an example of one of the ones that you just read and it was like, or heard as “Oh my gosh. This person completely captured the spirit of Brown”.

Lauren Zalaznick: Yep. There are a lot of letters around identity that is formed during college in relation to, being 10, 20, 30 or more years older than a graduate.

One, just to the point of governance, a 1972 graduate said that Brown as a trustee and an undergraduate, the quote is, “Brown has enabled me to explore how a university leads and responds to societal change to explore how to create the future”. That’s from a woman named Eileen [00:08:00] Rudden, a 1972 grad.

These are very high powered people, these are very committed people, and a lot show some vulnerability. One person said, upon his acceptance to Brown, “I knew no one. I was intimidated. I had been on one airplane in my life. I was on significant financial aid. I could not have imagined how four years would transform me and open my mind to the world”. And that’s from a guy named Todd Fisher, a 1987 grad. So you see that there are strengths, the gift of giving back is of course, a through line from trustees and fellows, but it was the kind of profound human snapshots that were unexpected for me and very moving.

Drumm McNaughton: And just you’re reading that little bit is like I can put myself [00:09:00] in that position of that one person never having been on an airplane before, traveling away from home for four years and the transformations are almost unfathomable.

Lauren Zalaznick: Here’s a gentleman who, mid seventies grad, and, just to the point of where you come from and what you expand your mind into. He said, “I arrived at our university 45 years ago during the Vietnam war”. So it was written a little while ago, “from a classic Midwestern farm state background. I have the attendant levels of anxiety regarding my ability to navigate the challenges of the more liberal mindset. Equally, I never imagined I would have the good fortune to spend the last six years as a trustee in the company of such extraordinarily wise, talented, diverse, [00:10:00] and committed corporation members”. And that’s from a wonderful guy called Kevin Munt, who graduated in ’76.

Drumm McNaughton: Wow, those are amazing. We’re going to get into more of those, but there was something that really struck me in the title of your book, “Letters From the Corporation of Brown University” and we understand it is a corporation similar to Harvard. The last thing, “Lives of Usefulness and Reputation”.

Lauren Zalaznick: Yes, and that sounds so stuffy and what I term, quote unquote, “yieldy”, but that’s the beauty of it. Those words, “Lives of Usefulness and Reputation”, I pulled from the charter, the founding charter in 1764 of the university. And really, it’s about the foundational mission of Brown. They didn’t call it a [00:11:00] mission statement or a vision statement then. It says “Institutions for liberal education are highly beneficial to society by forming the rising generation to virtue, knowledge, and useful literature, and thus preserving a succession of students, duly qualified for discharging the offices of life with usefulness and reputation.

And just to relate more than 250 years ago to today, when maybe the value of higher education itself is being questioned, these are a group of founders who absolutely have the vision that education is at the foundation of the benefit to society and that it’s the responsibility of the originators of the [00:12:00] corporation to establish that. And I think in our case writ large, each corporation member feels that duty and responsibility, and believe me, it comes out in very different ways from a very diverse body of 54 people, but the shared vision remains constant and in my experience over six years, and more particularly reading the letters of over 250 years, I see the struggle and I see the success of that charter as filtered through this body.

Drumm McNaughton: This reminds me of a leadership saying from Kouzes and Posner’s, “leadership is the art of motivating others to struggle for higher goals”. I don’t have it exactly right, but that’s what you’re talking about here. “Leadership is [00:13:00] the art of mobilizing others to want to struggle for shared aspirations.” -James Kouzes and Barry Posner – Leadership Development – San Diego.

Lauren Zalaznick: That’s exactly right. And we read about this, we’ve studied it, we’ve maybe gotten help from great people like you on this topic. And again, I got it reinforced from unearthing and researching and reading these letters. A guy named Art Joukowsky, Artemis A. W. Joukowsky, Jr., who graduated in 1955 and was also the chancellor of the university, he sums it up. And says, quote unquote, “leadership is not an abstract concept. It is rather a zestful, active engagement of energy and imagination to make things work, things we believe in”. If you have that from the leader of [00:14:00] the highest governing body of an institution, you probably, not only find inspiration in that, but, hold yourself to that high standard and you really want to perform. You really want to move the values of the university forward. And I think what’s implicit in it is that things are not static. The students are changing around you, the faculty is changing around you, and importantly, the country, the world is changing around you, and leadership has to be flexible, reactive, and, without sounding trickly, it has to be pure in its mission.

Drumm McNaughton: I found the quote. It’s leadership is the art of mobilizing others to want to struggle for shared [00:15:00] aspirations.

Lauren Zalaznick: Yep, that’s it. That really sums it up.

Drumm McNaughton: So right now higher ed’s going through a period of transition, with all the, last year was tumultuous especially for board members. The protests, debates, diversity, freedom of expression, changes in the country really are reflected on campus life.

Lauren Zalaznick: That’s right.

Drumm McNaughton: There was a lot of learnings that came out of the book on how to deal with, how they dealt with, how they struggled with, many of the same issues and what they did to make it work a little better. And when I look at Brown this spring, frankly, they did a really good job in dealing with the transitions.

Lauren Zalaznick: Yes, absolutely.. You know, credit goes to President Christina Paxson, Chancellor Sam [00:16:00] Menkoff, and the entire administrative staff and the Board of Trustees. I think a couple of key takeaways are that, number one you can’t have the hubris of thinking that you are perfect and or right about everything. I think one of the through lines in many of the communications is that the voices of the students are listened to, they’re respected, even when particular opinions are divergent, and that pretty consistently the communication is that the job of the university is to create an environment that is respectful, safe, and is one where tensions and divisions over [00:17:00] deeply held beliefs are effectively aired. And that is a pretty tall order, and it was imperfect, but positive.

I think one of the governance learnings from Chris Paxson and many of the public communications she’s shared is that creating a situation of significant points of difference, opinions of difference, even deep, I don’t know how to put it, inconvenience, disruption, is going to happen, but that in an kind of unwavering commitment to support academic freedom and freedom of expression within this open and respectful learning community, that is of the highest level of importance.

I think that this is not to say things go unchecked, but [00:18:00] that by, a decade plus of leadership experience President Paxson had some very important, solid, well-communicated policies, procedures, (rules by any other name), that helped put guardrails up between debate and the longstanding exceptions as to whether speech or behavior crosses a line. I think having that line defined helped Brown defray the most divisive actions that other schools certainly had. And as we get back to campus this fall, I think we’re seeing already. Again, imperfect, but a fair, even handed approach, and a consistent approach, with ways to ameliorate the [00:19:00] situation, got us quite a bit further than it could have been.

Drumm McNaughton: You gave me a great example when we spoke a couple of days ago about divestiture. Yeah. And one of the demands across the nation with the protests was that institutions, investment portfolios, et cetera, divest themselves from anything to do with Israel. How did Brown deal with that? I thought that was brilliant the way Brown did it, by the way. So how was it?

Lauren Zalaznick: I can’t speak exactly to what was said between the parties, but what is absolutely public is that there’s a very particular set of protocols. There are committees that review it. The committee on divestiture is comprised of students and the academic and administrative members. And the review in this particular case is expedited, [00:20:00] and that was a solemn promise to include students, include faculty, and include the administration in a very well defined process.

What I will say about the letters, and why the book gives me hope, is that this book was put to bed before last year’s campus climate issues. And for trustees to reach back, they can say anything they want on their way out the door, and letter after letter says something like, this is a great one from Stephen R. Jordan, who graduated in ’82, and he says, quote, “When I was asked to join the Board of Trustees I wasn’t sure they really wanted me if they had known I was one of those kids outside”, so he’s a new Brown, always an old Brown. Debra Lee, a vaunted business person, graduate 1976 says, “As a Brown [00:21:00] trustee, I can’t believe it. I was now officially part of the establishment and not on the outside of University Hall protesting some earth shattering issue”. Just to think about this group, proactively, not in the face of crisis when these letters were written, reaching back to remember how they were and what they were taught as students, which was to think critically, to express opinions respectfully, but strongly. I think those are the more global issues that I hope the book raises that can bridge gaps to current students rather than dig deeper trenches between a quote unquote “us and them”.

Drumm McNaughton: And we talked [00:22:00] about this and you alluded to it earlier. It’s because people are feeling heard, but with Brown, it starts a lot with Trustee selection. Please tell us about the conversation you had, the interview you did with the oldest living trustee at Brown.

Lauren Zalaznick: Basically, there’s two elements to this. And again, I fall back on Governance, which always sounds boring, but really has

Drumm McNaughton: Depends if it’s what you do and love it.

Lauren Zalaznick: Depends on your point of view, but to, again, why is this relevant for non-Brown people? Why is this book relevant for non trustees? There’s only a couple of thousand in the whole country who have ever been something called a trustee or a fellow of a college or university. That’s not great for communication. I think it’s not unusual for, [00:23:00] even people who are tapped as trustees who have never been in the room, to think of the board of trustees or a corporation as exclusive, mostly white, mostly male, mostly rich. When you get on the inside, at least at Brown’s corporation room, it’s not true. One of the points of governance that was instituted in my trusteeship tenure in the 2010s was the addition of two recent alumni trustees. And in general, a process by which the trustees are a definitionally diverse group.

So there’s 42 trustees, 13 are elected by alumni by popular vote, pursuant to an agreement from a while ago between the corporation and the alumni association. Those [00:24:00] 13 trustees include the current and two past Brown Alumni Association chairs, and 10 others elected to six year terms. So they are not tapped for fundraising. They are not tapped for audit committee expertise. They are tapped because the alumni, writ large, open to everyone to vote, has elected them.

Further to that, there are now two recent alumni trustees who, there was a lot of debate, should a person who has graduated within five years, that means 22 to 27 year old from undergraduate or maybe graduate school person, be in this room? And there was a ton of debate, and I would say that universally this was a change, about 10 years ago, that has [00:25:00] transformed the corporation for the better in terms of representation, understanding what new generations are thinking of. Traditionally if you’re just tapped on the shoulder to be a trustee somewhere, usually that is between 20 and 30, 40 years after graduation. This is within five years. You know what kids are thinking, you know what’s on students minds, you’ve had a leadership position within the undergraduate population usually.

So those are a couple of examples of putting together your board that leads to a diverse perspective of experience, age, to the extent that it informs your knowledge, geographic, racial, ethnic, all of the spectrum and multiple dimensions that make a whole sphere [00:26:00] of knowledge, work, wisdom come together is represented in this form of governance.

Drumm McNaughton: And it needs to be at every board level. I can’t tell you the number of institutions that I’ve worked with at the board level and I say, you need to have a student on your board. “Oh, my God, we can’t do that. What if they tell the other students about this, what’s going on?”

First off, you’ve got to trust them that they do that, but how else are you going to see it? Especially with private institutions. And I take a look at the list of board members. You’ll see The board member and the paren, whatever the year was. And the ones that scared me the most, you’ve got a board full of people who graduated 30 and 40 years ago and that’s what they remember the experience to be and that’s what they want to go back to Instead of bringing students, faculty on there to tell the board members this is [00:27:00] what the reality is right now.

Lauren Zalaznick: Right and trust works both ways. If you’re in the boardroom of a corporation or any not for profit or an educational institution, it’s duty bound. You don’t share anything outside the corporation room. It was hard to publish this book of letters. These letters are private. The authors own their letters, even though they were sent to Brown. And we got permission from each and every author to publish these letters. That alone represents the trust, mutually, between the institution, the trustee and the outside world. In the same way that people are worried that a 20 something person is not going to be able to uphold those duties, I think we should think about that from every person who is invited [00:28:00] into a role such as this. And really, it’s like the reverse osmosis far outweighs the risk of a quote unquote “leak”.

What you get from a recent alum is a direct pipeline into the thought processes, the modes of communication. Just think about the slowness of boards and corporations understanding the power of digital media, and then understanding the power of social media. This was a time when corporations didn’t even understand what kids were upset about because they were not on the channels of social media everyone under the age of X was communicating with. That’s a very tactical example of how a mind shift perspective. They don’t have to work hard at finding what people are talking about because they are in those media and can be [00:29:00] efficient and effective translators of how that board, how that corporation can meet a student body where they are.

Drumm McNaughton: We’re getting close to the end of our time. I it’s you were right when we talked, we’ve got way more stuff than we did for half, three quarters of an hour, but I do want to touch on one of the things that you had said. The importance of term limits on boards and then relating the governance to your own experience, you know “Occupy the Green”. Mirroring “Occupy Wall Street”.

Lauren Zalaznick: Yeah. Just to tease those out, the second thing you mentioned is that, again, irrespective of today’s campus climate, when I walked across my own college green in the fall of 2011, there was a protest going on called “Occupy the Green”, which if people recall, at that time was a mirror of this much larger [00:30:00] protest, which originated in New York City called “Occupy Wall Street”. And that was just a reminder for me that, we all have something in common with someone else, and if you don’t take the time to pick your head up, listen to what someone is saying, sharing with you, telling their story, you’re probably never going to be able to meet them where they are, and I don’t mean agree, we’re not all going to always agree with everyone, but we are going to be able to listen to what the person across from you is actually saying, and maybe take away something that everyone can relate to. And to that, I guess one of the things I noticed as a point of governance on term limits, very separate from this idea of students are always protesting and grown ups are always perturbed, and [00:31:00] how do you bridge that gap for 60, 70 years since, really the most fundamental protest of the civil rights and freedom of expression of the late 50s, early 60s, on to the Vietnam War, on to divest from South Africa, fossil fuels debates. This is not new, but always important. That’s point number one.

To the term limits, what I noticed researching and reading all the letters is that Brown has had differing term limit governances by amendment for many decades, and before there were official term limits, I guess you were in for life, and term limits were established in the late 60s, early 70s. So anyone who had already been a trustee was allowed to ride out their trusteeship for their life term. And as the board turned over many of the letters [00:32:00] reflected bewilderment and without being flip about it, hey, Good luck.

One woman wrote, who graduated in ’41, so a very early Ivy League college grad, Ruth Harris Wolf said, quote, “My social attitudes have changed as a result of my corporation membership and my consciousness in regard to women in our co-educational institution and the larger society has been sharpened”. And so that’s someone who had an opportunity to hear very different voices from when she was an undergraduate, et cetera, et cetera.

One of my favorite ones was also from around that time of unbelievable turmoil in the Vietnam War, diversity on campus mandates. And I guess my point is that, if you keep refreshing the [00:33:00] board, but you give each corporation member the time to acclimate, understand, and effect some change, but then make room for a new voice, you’re going to get great decision making without losing the institutional knowledge that’s so important. And the letters really just speak to these profound human stories of this preamble great ambition of leading lives of usefulness and reputation, and being firm in the belief that’s what higher ed is for.

Drumm McNaughton: Absolutely. And the last thing before we get to our final two questions, which we always do is in talking with that oldest living trustee.

Lauren Zalaznick: Yes.

Drumm McNaughton: And before we get to that conversation, because that was really touching for me. There’s three different kinds [00:34:00] of people that you have on boards. Money, and then, help me out with that.

Lauren Zalaznick: Yeah, , wrote the book, I edited the book and I wrote a long introduction to share how it came together and what inspired me. I also have a foreword by a woman named Ruth Ekstrom, and she is the oldest living officer of the corporation, and she happens to be the first female officer of the corporation, she was a secretary in the 1970s. And, what she said was that she traveled to Brown, sworn in as a corporation member, her first meeting, and the chancellor at the time met with some of the new trustees, she was the only woman, to explain what was expected of them. And he talked about an early Brown president named President Wriston, who had said that the [00:35:00] qualities he looked for in corporation members were three things, work, wealth and wisdom, but that he would settle for any one out of those three, two would be great, three is a home run. And what she said, which was very poignant, was that she did not have wealth. She had an eagerness to work harder than anyone, and she had wisdom to share about the academics, leadership, and, governance for the corporation.

And the ethos of having one or two of those three, work, wealth, or wisdom is apparent when you read these letters, and when you read the bios of the 54 corporation members to this day.

My observation is, if there’s one takeaway for university presidents [00:36:00] or officers of boards or corporations or trustees or fellows or, anyone who’s really in a position to move their university forward through a leadership position, it’s that the loudest voice in the room can never be defined as the most powerful through their influence through wealth. I think it was, really, incredible person named Tom Rothman, Thomas E. Rothman, who graduated in ’76, who gave a word of advice on his way out, when his term was up, who said, “I hope the corporation will seek a wide ranging and diverse mix of backgrounds and viewpoints in its future membership. It’s through the fires of divergence, not the comforts of homogeneity that this storied institution shines the brightest”. And to me that kind of [00:37:00] says it all.

Drumm McNaughton: And I think that is a great thing to wrap up on it’s not about homogeneity, it’s about diversity, difference, and learning how to work together.

Lauren Zalaznick: Yep. Even through, especially through, I should say, all of the seminal events, confrontations, strategic plans from everything we know how difficult it is to balance, in the leadership of a university. Those elements have to be true. You have to, evolve with respect to your institution’s most enduring and important traditions, but those should only help inform your perspectives on the range of issues that you’re grappling with now and forecasting for the future.

Drumm McNaughton: And I would add one to that is, making sure you’re staying true [00:38:00] to your core values.

Lauren Zalaznick: No question. A shared ethos is the beginning and the end of success. Articulate it clearly, make sure everyone sees it in the same way and then you can have debate, rigorous thought, and come to conclusions, however haltingly you’ll have progress.

Drumm McNaughton: Very good. Lauren, this has been a true pleasure. Thank you so much. Three takeaways for university presidents and boards. You’ve already hit on one of them.

Lauren Zalaznick: Number one is remember who you were at the time of your undergraduate education and compare it to how you feel about those undergraduates today. The flip side of that is really, truly have a commitment to all forms of diverse lived experience, where [00:39:00] people come from, who they are, and how they think. And my selfish takeaway is that I think people, if they can buy this book, “Letters From the Corporation of Brown University”, on the Amazon website, will truly derive human story value.

I defy anyone to read this and not to shed a tear at one time or another. And, you will deliver valuable governance lessons to your institution.

Drumm McNaughton: Those are great. Thank you so much. What’s next for you?

Lauren Zalaznick: This is the first book that I’ve personally edited and so i’m going to concentrate on getting that into the hands of as many people as possible. I publish, newsletter every Sunday called the LZ Sunday paper on Substack, and I’m very focused on bringing the news of the week to everyone through the lens of from politics to pop culture, news that is [00:40:00] by, for, and about women. And of course, I am a full time, very busy media consultant at the ready, trying to solve that world’s problems too.

Drumm McNaughton: Very good. It sounds like you’re quite busy and I’m very happy for you. Thank you so much for spending time with me today. I’ve thoroughly enjoyed our conversation. I want to do it again.

Lauren Zalaznick: I hope so. It was terrific for me and I hope everyone who hears it gets something valuable out of it.

Drumm McNaughton: I am sure they will. Again, thank you.

Lauren Zalaznick: Thanks.

Drumm McNaughton: Thanks for listening and a very special thank you to our guest Lauren Zalaznick and for her sharing with us her perspectives on how boards can improve their governance muscles. Lauren, I thoroughly enjoyed our conversation. Thank you, and I look forward to having you on the show at another time.

Join me next time when I welcome Teege Mettille to the program. Teege has been on the student enrollment side of the house for 20 years and he joins us to [00:41:00] talk about his recent book, “The Admission Counselor Malaise”, and the lessons that he’s learned over the years on how to build high performing admissions teams that fulfill the delicate balance between enrollment numbers and being mission-driven.

Thanks for listening. See you next week.